Funny how it's the small stuff that starts the process off.... Staches for you, beards for me! Sorry it all went wrong for you, but glad you're happy now..
Captain Blithering
JoinedPosts by Captain Blithering
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40
New here, just wanted to say "Hello"
by Goldiver inhello all, it is nice to have a forum for former jw's and see i wasn't the only one out there having serious doubts.
my parents got into it when i was about 4 years old.
my family was part of the granville ny congregation.. my dad in time became an elder.
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next week's bible reading (Gen. 1-5) stumpers.for your "in" family conversations & sly comments.
by prologos inyou may add many, but here are two:.
1) vegetation made on day 3, animals formed day 5,6, but- then.
in gen 2, man seems to be the primary creation, and vegetation and then animals were formed from the dust and brought to him to name them.
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Captain Blithering
Bats on the belfry, thanks for that, that's brilliant... Point out an inconsistency, say 'does it matter', then quote that box. (obviously stressing the need for us to do research and make the truth our own). Job's a good'un!
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next week's bible reading (Gen. 1-5) stumpers.for your "in" family conversations & sly comments.
by prologos inyou may add many, but here are two:.
1) vegetation made on day 3, animals formed day 5,6, but- then.
in gen 2, man seems to be the primary creation, and vegetation and then animals were formed from the dust and brought to him to name them.
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Captain Blithering
Can anyone suggest some GENUINE well-worded comments that we could make regarding any of these inconsistencies, for example, the order of events in creation, like "SOME say that such and such proves the bible to be hogwash but we know that it's easily explained by (insert lame excuse here)".. not enough to get rumbled but enough to show the cong that there ARE inconsistencies....?
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They have slipped it in ........
by Slidin Fast inas we know, we can search the bible from cover to cover and we dont find any reference to the governing body.
not now, it has been slipped in for the outine of contents for acts 15. here we are looking at history through a modern, distorting lens.. outline of contents.
dispute in antioch regarding circumcision (1, 2)question brought to jerusalem (3-5)elders and apostles meet together (6-21)letter from the governing body (22-29)?
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Captain Blithering
Ooh sneaky beggars !
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"Jehovah ALWAYS had/used an organization". How would you reply?
by EdenOne inin a recent meeting with elders, an argument was used to the effect that jehovah has always [= throughout history] used, or operated through, an organization; therefore, the wts must be that organization today, since god must be using one.
naturally, i know what arguments i've used to counter that argument.
but i'm interested in hearing yours.
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Captain Blithering
Devil's advocate speaking, if there was to be no organisation, why would there be all the talk of overseers and congregations etc? (if you're talking to someone that's not ready to discount the bible as a disparate bunch of collected mens words...)
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RNWT bible "large print" version due out?
by 88JM ini'd totally forgotten about it, but the literature department at the local congregation here was taking orders for "large print" versions of the new bible.. has anyone seen one in the wild?.
why isn't it on jw.org yet - i'm sure they said it would be in january?.
is it really just a "large print" version, or is it a "reference" version with extra bits?.
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Captain Blithering
Not seen one but I've been told it's just a large print version of the rnwt NOT a reference bible.. Apparently that along with a pocket bible, are in the works...
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"Jehovah ALWAYS had/used an organization". How would you reply?
by EdenOne inin a recent meeting with elders, an argument was used to the effect that jehovah has always [= throughout history] used, or operated through, an organization; therefore, the wts must be that organization today, since god must be using one.
naturally, i know what arguments i've used to counter that argument.
but i'm interested in hearing yours.
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Captain Blithering
I had this come up the other day, ive been formulating replies on paper, this thread is brilliant, thanks for starting it!
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BIG conversation with the missus MKII. Ended well. Wish I could argue better!
by Captain Blithering inwell, had a loooooooong conversation with the missus again after being accused of being overly critical of the borg.. .
i stated that i thought the borg was marvellous, full of really good people, (in our experience, it has been so far), but that i had difficulty with the dogmatic stance we had on certain issues that we couldn't possibly be sure about, and that if i were to vocalise any of these issues and unrepentantly not change my thinking, then i could be df'd for that, which i view as an unloving bullying tactic.
organ transplants, vaccinations, (jah will resurrect, don't worry), new understandings of the fads and generations etc... particularly the thought that only jw's will be saved.
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Captain Blithering
Cheers Kate , it's going better than I expected so far, but like snare says, there's a tipping point where I'm gonna have to take a stand , a proper stand , we'll see then where that leaves me. . . .
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Where else is there to go?
by snare&racket inwhen i left the jw's, close friends and some elders discussed my desicion with me,without fail they all concluded the same thing.... "but where else is there to go?!".
at the time, the question just confused me, i could not see why it confused me or the very telling nature of such a comment.
i never thought that once.. firstly, this indicates that many jw's remain jw's simply because of this tunnel vision perspective... everything in their periphery is valueless, but the wt on which they focus is everthing.
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Captain Blithering
Can I get aaaaaAMEN! the question is, how do we make that cog click on to the last tooth without inducing the cult brain - shutdown mentality in those we love? Gently gently, im told...
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BIG conversation with the missus MKII. Ended well. Wish I could argue better!
by Captain Blithering inwell, had a loooooooong conversation with the missus again after being accused of being overly critical of the borg.. .
i stated that i thought the borg was marvellous, full of really good people, (in our experience, it has been so far), but that i had difficulty with the dogmatic stance we had on certain issues that we couldn't possibly be sure about, and that if i were to vocalise any of these issues and unrepentantly not change my thinking, then i could be df'd for that, which i view as an unloving bullying tactic.
organ transplants, vaccinations, (jah will resurrect, don't worry), new understandings of the fads and generations etc... particularly the thought that only jw's will be saved.
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Captain Blithering
That's some good reasoning exwhyzee, I'll store them up for future use.
And Black Sheep, you're quite right, I'm doing all the work here, i MUST remember that next time, that if a claim is made that is clearly bunkum I shall definitely make a challenge for evidence. Thanks!
And Steve2, I used the word arguing wrongly I think, it was more of a deep discussion, BUT i get your point, that rather than coming at it from a "I hold THIS viewpoint but you hold THAT viewpoint" , I should adopt the 'wondering' 'help me understand' position a lot more than I do.
Thanks for the advice guys, it's really appreciated..
(I've just remembered that a bit of the convo was about the demanding of unquestioning obedience to the GB under threat of expulsion, and in the next couple of weeks we've got the wt about following guidance even though it may seem illogical. Hope that sparks a thought.)